Summary for organic finish Discussion
organic finish is the thread’s central question, and the replies show why the term causes confusion. The original poster asks for a basic, easy-to-understand definition and examples, noting that aerospace specs often separate paint from organic finishes or organic from inorganic finishes without defining the terms. Tom Gallant answers simply that if a chemical compound contains carbon, it is organic; otherwise it is inorganic. James Watts adds an important caution that definitions can be tricky, pointing to carbides in steel and tungsten carbide as examples that complicate a simple carbon-based rule. In the later aerospace-quality question, Bill William Doherty suggests it may be easier to define the opposite term: inorganic finishes are essentially metallic processes such as electroplating and galvanizing. The thread does not settle on a universal industry definition, but it does highlight the broad distinction between carbon-based coatings and metallic finishes.
Q. I am looking for some technical information for Organic finish, could you please tell me what kind of finish of this Organic finish?
Eileen
Cosmic China – Foshan, Guangdong , China
2004
A. I’d say that any finish that is comprised of leaving a primarily organic chemical on the surface is an organic finish. Painting & powder coating are organic finishes whereas plating, anodizing, PVD finishes, & black oxide are inorganic finishes.
Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com – Pine Beach, New Jersey
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2004
A. If chemical compound contains Carbon, it is organic. Otherwise it is inorganic.
Tom Gallant
– Long Beach, California, USA
2004
Steel contains carbon, are you saying that it is organic?
James Watts
– Navarre, Florida
2004
2004
Didn’t you see The Terminator, James? :-)
Actually, even if the carbon itself was in the form of an organic compound (and I don’t think it is), steel is not a compound, it’s a mixture. As another example, even though nickel plating occludes small amounts of organic compounds from the wetters, levelers, and brighteners I wouldn’t call it an organic coating either.
Ted Mooney, P.E.
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finishing.com – Pine Beach, New Jersey
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br
OK, I was thinking more of the carbides in steel vs the alloyed carbon. If that does not sell, how about tungsten carbide? WC?
I was just trying to point out that you have to be careful with definitions.
James Watts
– Navarre, Florida
2004
Hi again. WC is inorganic and Tom’s answer was incorrect.
Regards,
Ted Mooney, P.E.
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finishing.com – Pine Beach, New Jersey
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Ed. note: letter 15246, “What is inorganic paint”, offers additional perspectives on this issue.
Definition of Organic Finish?
Q. I’ve been in the aerospace quality environment for nearly 20 years now. I’ve worked in both the contract manufacturing and design & development arenas. I’ve worked with prime OEM specs as well as numerous other mfgr specs, and through it all I have always been confused about the definition of ‘organic’ and ‘inorganic’ finishes.
In all my years and in all my experience I have never found a universally agreed upon definition of ‘organic finish’. One spec might have separate acceptance criteria listed for paint and organic finishes. Another spec might just distinguish between organic and inorganic finishes. Both of these approaches assume the user understands the distinction — which I don’t.
It’s frustrating to someone like myself who does not have the training and experience in the chemical and finishing technologies to try to interpret a term that seems to be so basic as to preclude the need for a definition.
I have reviewed several prior posts on this website regarding this subject and have come to the conclusion that there is almost universal disagreement or misunderstanding of the term ‘organic finish’ even among users here.
Can we try again? Can anyone provide a basic, easy to understand definition of what ‘organic finish’ means, with perhaps some examples?
Kelly Moreland
Quality Engineer, Aerospace – Portland, Oregon, USA
November 3, 2015
A. I would think it easier to define an inorganic finish:
Essentially any metallic process like electroplate, galvanise, etc.
Hope this helps to distinguish.
Regards,
Bill
William Doherty
Trainer – Salamander Bay, Australia
November 8, 2015