topic 16343
Blue patina for zinc
A discussion started in 2000
and continuing through 2016 so far.
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Q. Can anyone tell me how I can speed up the process of verdigris on zinc to achieve the green patina one sees on aged zinc clad rooftops. Best regards,
james Fox- london england
2000
A. James, verdigris green patina occurs on copper roofs, not on zinc ones, because the green color is a copper salt. Zinc roofs never turn verdigris color. Sorry.
For interior, lighter exposure, you can probably apply a copper-based patina solution, but on an actual roof the color would never hold up.
Ted Mooney, P.E.
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
Striving to live Aloha
2002
Q. Patination of zinc sheet. I'd like to hear any recipes or techniques to color zinc.
Ken V [last name deleted for privacy by Editor]- Scottsdale, Arizona, USA
2002
- Black for zinc:
- Cu(NO3)2......6,25 gm
NH4Cl.........6,25 gm
CuCl2.........6,25 gm
HCl..........6,25 ml
H2O...........1 lit.
- Bronze brown for zinc:
- iron sulphate......50 gm
copper sulphate....50 gm
H2O..........1 lit.
- Blue for zinc:
- nickel sulphate.......60 gm
ammonium chloride......60 gm
H2O............1 lit.
- Lustre colors for zinc:
- NaOH........83 gm
copper tartrate..62 gm
H2O........ 1 lit. - At 10 °C temp., 2 min. violet, 3 min. blue, 4-5 min. green, 6-7 min. yellow, 8-9 min.very dark red, without lacquering or waxing!
- Zagreb, Croatia
2002
Thank you, Goran Budija, for those recipes. I am anxious to try them.
- Scottsdale, Arizona, USA
Hi, Ken. Goran is a metals conservator and seems to always have the answers I don't expect! Thanks as usual, Goran.
Regards,
Ted Mooney, P.E.
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
Striving to live Aloha
To minimize search efforts and to offer multiple viewpoints, we combined previously separate threads onto this page. Please forgive any resultant repetition, failures of chronological order, or what may look like readers disrespecting previous responses -- those other responses may not have been on the page at the time :-)
2002
Q. I designed a zinc sheet metal ceiling for a powder room at my client's residence. The metalworker who installed it did not patina it before installation, now is struggling with trying to add the patina in a finished room. I wanted a "bluing" finish, and I know there are patinas available that can do this. Can it be used on zinc? Can it be done after installation? It seems that most patinas recommend immersion in the chemical, which is not possible in this situation.
The metalworker wants to faux paint it - I hate the idea - why would I use metal to do this? What do I tell him to do? He obviously has no experience in this kind of work. Help!
Kathryn Scottdesign studio - Brooklyn, New York, USA
2002
A. I am maybe a bit confused, Kathryn. It's possible to get blue (verdigris?) patinas on copper, brass, and bronze because copper salts are blue-green, but zinc salts are not. You can probably wipe on a copper-based patina solution with enough effort if that's the look you seek ... but only practice makes perfect.
Ted Mooney, P.E.
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
Striving to live Aloha
2002
A. The term "bluing" is a generic term used in metal finishing of "steel" parts - most common in the firearms industry. The "blue" actually comes from the light reflection of an oil that is applied to protect the black oxide-type finish. That said, you may want to try a tinted lacquer to achieve the proper color, because an oxidizing process to color your zinc sheet will require immersion to achieve color uniformity. Also, a lacquer will help preserve the color and resist further natural oxidation. I would apologize to the metalworker, and then find an acceptable color/finish and tell your customer that they now have a one-of-a-kind ceiling.
Dan Brewerchemical process supplier - Gurnee, Illinois
2003
A. You can put a antique Patina finish easily on your Zinc ceiling using the right chemicals in a spray bottle. I purchased an acid made for bluing steel that works great on Zinc.
We make Zinc counter tops all the time and I antique them then add a butchers wax finish.
- Bethel, Connecticut USA
A. Now I'm more confused than ever :-)
I assumed, probably wrongly, that when Kathryn said 'blue patina for sheet metal' she was looking for the mottled verdigris blue we may see on old roofs and gutters.
Dan seems to think she wants a black oxide finish (gun bluing), which on a highly polished surface looks a very dark jewel blue.
Rick is apparently very experienced, and can achieve a successful patina with a spray bottle, but describes it as 'antique Patina finish', which I assume is much paler and less saturated than what I envisioned or Dan envisioned.
Can we get a better idea what Kathryn means by 'blue'? :-)
Luck & Regards,
Ted Mooney, P.E.
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
Striving to live Aloha
affil. link
Birchwood-Casey Gun Bluing
Q. I read with interest the answers to the questions on bluing zinc -- I would like to understand better what bluing does and further finishing steps for zinc applied as a panel on a kitchen island.
Susan Phillips-Hungerfordarchitect - Peterborough, New Hampshire
2006
Q. I would like to have a galvanized metal picnic table top and would like to darken it with a stain. Do you have any product recommendations?
Paul Micallefvineyard - Healdsburg, California
April 16, 2008
Q. Question for Rick V.
Rick,
Could you please be more specific about the products you used to patina your counter top?
I am making cafe tables with a zinc top and am interested in your process.
hobbyist - Paonia, Colorado, USA
April 18, 2008
A. Hello, Jean. While new people read the threads every day and may be able to help you, Rick's reply is quite old, and it's unlikely that he visits this thread often if at all :-)
Jax Patina [affil. link to product info on Amazon] may not be exactly what Rick uses, but should get you a blue-green patina. If, again, that's the look you're hunting for. Good luck.
Regards,
Ted Mooney, P.E.
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
Striving to live Aloha
August 22, 2008
Q. My question is directed to the gentleman w/ the blue patina - Rickie?
I have this O ring that is brown. I was wondering if you might be able to assist me by coloring my brown O ring a blue patina. I know that it will be a very attractive look, and feel this could be the start of a huge movement. I mean the market is untapped. We need to make this dream a blue patina'd reality.
sheet metal fetishist - Reno, Nevada
----
Ed. note: Hi Alonso. What is this "brown O ring"? What kind of sheet metal is it made of? Can you send a photo to mooney@finishing.com for posting here?
2004
I am looking for a safe formula for applying a verdigris patina to the solder lines and zinc framing on an assembled stained glass panel. I have seen many formulas calling for the use of ammonia solutions, which I cannot use for health reasons. Any information would be greatly appreciated.
Justin Hanningtonstained glass artist - Burlington, Vermont, USA
affil. link
Modern Masters Green Patina
A. Hi Justin. Verdigris patinas are possible (and can even occur naturally) on copper, brass, and bronze because copper salts are that color. But to get verdigris color on solder and zinc, you need to put copper on them; the easiest way is with a commercial patina solution.
You can probably check the MSDS to make sure they don't have ammonia.
Luck & Regards,
Ted Mooney, P.E. RET
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
Aloha -- an idea worth spreading
2004
A. You can use copper nitrate based patina: 300 gms copper nitrate/1 lit water only for grease and oxide free surfaces!
Good luck!
Goran Budijaconservator - Zagreb, Croatia
July 21, 2008
A. Have you thought about faking it, with a thin layer of acrylic paint? I suppose you make lamp shades, so they would never be submersed in water?
Milli Denney- Leicester, Vermont, Addison
Patinas for zamak cast sculpture
2005Q. I am an sculptor searching to use ZAMAK to cast small and medium sized sculpture. I need information regarding formulas, manuals, white papers, pdf, how-to, downloadable file on methods and formulas to apply permanent patinas of different color (including brass) to ZAMAK.
Thanks very much,
Reinaldo MartínezSculpture - San Antonio de los Altos, Miranda, VENEZUELA
2005
A. You can try next website (download free): http://www.thelitterbox.org/librum/i-sacof/433.gif !
black for zinc:
200 gm iron chloride
1 lit water
Good luck!
Goran Budija- Zagreb, Croatia
----
Ed. note: Goran's link is broken, and we could not easily find the new location (if any) of the particular article in question ... but librum (www.librum.us) is without doubt one of the most fascinating sites you'll find!
affil. link
Jax Green Patina
Q. Hi,
Please help! I would like to find out how I can add green patina onto Pewter or Copper? Want to give it an antique look?
Can you buy green patina, if so, where can you buy it? or do you use some kind of chemical reaction to react with it, if so, what chemical?
Please reply...
Thank you in advance...
Regards,
pewter art - London, England
2005 -- this entry appended to this thread by editor in lieu of spawning a duplicative thread
Q. How pewter can be aged in a fast and environmental friendly way.
Ben Groenewoud- Hradistko pod Mednikem, Czech Republic
affil. link
"Contemporary Patination"
from Abe Books
or
Hi, Ben. Please see such books as "Color on Metal" [affil. link to book info on Amazon], "Colouring, Bronzing & Patination of Metals" [affil. link to book info on Amazon], Contemporary Patination =>
and "Patinas for Silicon Bronze" [affil. link to book info on Amazon].
Yes, you can buy patina kits and chemicals such as Green Patina from Sophisticated Finishes [affil. link to product info on Amazon].
It may also be possible to get some simple patinas on certain metals by repeated application of household chemicals like vinegar and salt; that subject has been covered many times on these pages, so use the search engine or see the FAQ on that subject. Good luck.
Regards,
Ted Mooney, P.E.
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
Striving to live Aloha
To minimize search efforts and to offer multiple viewpoints, we combined previously separate threads onto this page. Please forgive any resultant repetition, failures of chronological order, or what may look like readers disrespecting previous responses -- those other responses may not have been on the page at the time :-)
Patinas on Hot Dipped Galvanized Steel
2005Q. I am manufacturing a line of steel garden furniture that I have Hot Dip Galvanized. I am looking for a patina solution that will give me a reasonably permanent coating resistant to rubbing off on someones clothing. A bluish color with a white overcast would be fine as well as a blue-green or black-purple tone. Any ideas? I have tried numerous acid solutions but still have not come up with a satisfactory patina. Ammonia and salt give a great look but only a temporary powdery finish. Help!
Ross YedinakGarden Furniture and sculpture - Pontiac, Michigan
2005
Hi Ross. I've personally not heard of a good patina for galvanized steel, but there's always a first time.
Ted Mooney, P.E.
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
Striving to live Aloha
2005
A. If your objects are zinc plated You can use any solution for colouring zinc. If you want verdigris type colour You must first copper plate your objects, then you can colour them like copper. And one formula for blue/violet blue patina for zinc:
60 gm nickel sulphate
60 gm ammonium chloride
1 lit water
Immerse object in solution,. If you use ammonium nickel sulphate You can obtain violet blue colour.
Hope it helps!
- Zagreb, Croatia
2006
Q. I am looking for the formula/technique that includes a combination of copper sulfate and ammonium chloride. Either in combined solutions (with water) or to be used separately as a wipe-on process for creating a weathered patina on galvanized metal roofing and hot dipped gutters.
Kim Lazareexhibits painter at Woodland Park Zoo - Seattle, Washington, USA
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April 28, 2008
RFQ: In reference to zinc finishing, I was interested in finding zinc sheets in Arizona do you have info? b callaway- phx, Arizona usa ^- Sorry, this RFQ is outdated View Current RFQs April 28, 2008 A. Hello B. I can't suggest a source in Arizona specifically, but our readers did suggest a few sources in letter 24550. Hopefully one of them will work out for you! Regards,
Ted Mooney, P.E. finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey Striving to live Aloha |
Blue Patina on Zinc Sheet Metal
June 28, 2016Q. Hello Professionals,
I have a job for a 2' x 13' zinc table top. The designer is asking for a blue/gray/antique finish on the zinc top. I have been searching online all day about patinas and making calls to find out if there is such a finish for Zinc. I am thinking not, but it's worth a shot asking here as I keep pulling up threads with excellent and highly resourceful responses by individuals.
So far I have found only a handful of colors that can be attained. Black/grays/browns/rust tones. I have been reading and many people seem to refer to the natural zinc color as a blue/gray. I am looking for a definite light and dark blue finish with grays.
I found a website that sells metal stains and after speaking with the rep, they seemed convinced that their product could put color into the zinc so long as it was degreased and scuffed with a scotchbrite pad. I figured I would ask here first before dropping the money just to do samples and testing. That stuff adds up in dollars pretty quickly.
I will also be applying multiple clear coats over the surface to hopefully protect the metal from oxidation and wear. An important thing to note is this is going to be in a house that is surrounded on 3 sides by ocean! I am unsure of how this will affect the zinc top over time.
Job Shop Owner - Pine Island, New Jersey