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Any health issues with the vinegar and solution?





July 13, 2010

WELL I HAVE BEEN AROUND A METAL ETCHING ARTISAN. I HAVE SEEN THE VINEGAR AND SOLUTION WORK ON THE METAL, THIS WORKS VERY WELL. BUT! I WAS ALSO EXPOSED TO THE TOXIC FUMES THAT THIS MIX GAVE OUT. IS THERE ANY ONE ELSE OUT THERE THAT HAS HAD THE SAME EXP? IT WAS DONE IN THE OUT DOORS AND IT WAS VARY VARY STRONG TO THE POINT OF FAINT. IF SO WHAT DID YOU DO ABOUT THE PAIN THAT IT CAUSED THE BODY. IT COMES AND GO'S.

PEDRO CRUZ
VISITOR - ELLISION VALLY, California, USA



July 16, 2010

Pedro, you left out some important information. How strong was the vinegar, what is the solution that you refer to and what is the metal that was etched.
Then, what was the quantity or size of the tank?
What was the exposure time?
You need to find a specialist-doctor- to ask this question to.
Why were you not using proper protective equipment --IF-- you noticed a problem the first time?

To answer (guess)anything at this time would be wild speculation.

James Watts
- Navarre, Florida



July 22, 2010

NICE TO MEET SOMEONE WITH CONCERN. SEE. I HAVE ASK THE ARTISAN WHAT THE SMELL WAS THIS ONE TIME THAT I WAS WORKING OUTSIDE ABOUT 30 FEET AWAY FROM WHERE HE WAS SPRAYING THIS STUFF FROM A SPRAY BOTTLE. I HAD TO WAIT FOR HIM TO GET BACK. HE WOULD ALWAYS LEAVE WHEN HE WOULD SPRAY THIS STUFF ON SHEET METAL. THE SHEET METAL WOULD BE PARTLY PAINTED.

WELL I WALKED AWAY FROM THE AREA FOR A BIT UNTIL THE SMELL WAS NOT noticeable. FOR ABOUT 25 MIN. SO WHEN HE RETURNED I ASKED WHAT WAS THAT SMELL AND HE TOLD ME THAT IT WAS STRAIGHT VINEGAR. I TOLD HIM NO WAY, VINEGAR DOES NOT SMELL THAT BAD, OR THAT NASTY. AND THEN HE WALKED AWAY. I TOLD THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY ABOUT THIS INCIDENT. HE SAID THAT HE WOULD LOOK INTO IT.

A COUPLE OF WEEKS LATER THE OWNER OF THE PROPERTY ASKED ME TO INSTALL CERAMIC WALL TILE IN THE RESTROOM OF THE ARTISAN SHOP. THE SECOND DAY THAT I WAS TILING, IN THE EVENING I WAS INSTALLING THE TRIM AND I WAS ON A SHORT LADDER WHEN THIS SMELL CAME INTO THE RESTROOM AND HIT ME SO HARD THAT I HAD TO HOLD ON TO THE WALL SO I WOULD NOT FALL OFF THE LADDER, AT THAT MOMENT HE WAS RIGHT THERE AND WAS TELLING ME THAT HE WAS LEAVING FOR THE EVENING. I THEN ASKED HIM IF HE USED THAT STUFF AGAIN, AND HE TOLD ME HA HA OH YOU MEAN THE VINEGAR OH I KNOW THAT YOU don't LIKE THE SMELL. AND HE LEFT. I SLOWLY WALKED OUT SIDE.

NOW THERE IS A 10 FOOT WIDE ROLL UP DOOR ABOUT 8 FEET AWAY FROM THE RESTROOM DOOR THAT WAS NOT EVEN UP BECAUSE I WAS TILING AND I NEEDED THE ROOM, AND THERE WAS A SLIGHT BREEZE. I SAT OUTSIDE FOR ABOUT TEN MINUTES. THEN WENT BACK INSIDE AND I COULD NOT GET MYSELF TOGETHER. I TURNED ON A FAN THAT WAS INSIDE AND IT MADE IT WORSE. I WENT BACK OUTSIDE. I COULD STILL SMELL IT OUTSIDE. I FELT LIKE THROWING UP, HAD A HARD TIME STANDING UP.

THEN THE OWNERS LAST TWO WORKERS CAME TO DROP OFF THE COMPANY'S TRUCKS. THE OWNER WAS NOT THERE, BUT HIS SHOP IS ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE BUILDING ON THE SAME LOT. I THEN TALKED TO ONE OF THE WORKERS ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED AND HE SMELLED THE SMELL AND FELT THE SAME WAY. AND THEN THE SAME WITH THE OTHER WORKER. I LOCKED UP THE ARTISAN'S SHOP AND WAITED OUTSIDE FOR ABOUT A HOUR UNTIL I FELT SOMEWHAT OK TO DRIVE. WHILE I WAS WAITING OUT THERE I WAS LOOKING FOR WHERE THIS WAS COMING FROM. ALL I COULD SEE WAS A SHEET OF METAL WITH PAINT ON IT AND STREAKS ON IT. I HAD A TASTE OF METAL LIKE WHEN YOU CUT CAST IRON WITH A GRINDER. SO THE NEXT DAY I ASK WHAT WAS MIXED WITH THE VINEGAR. BOY HE REALLY GOT VERY UPSET CAUSE I TOLD HIM THAT IF HE WAS GOING TO USE THE CHEMICAL SMELLING STUFF THAT I COULD NOT WORK THERE, SO HE TOLD ME TO GET THE HELL OUT. OH ONE OF THE WORKERS SAID THAT IT SMELLED LIKE AMMONIA AND VINEGAR. LOOK I SAY IF IT SMELLS LIKE CHEMICAL IT IS NOT GOOD FOR YOU. I FEEL THAT THE OWNER DID NOT BELIEVE ME, ON HOW BAD THE SMELL WAS AND HOW MUCH IT HURT ME. I DID SOME RESEARCH AND FOUND OUT THAT VINEGAR AND A LITTLE BAKING SODA AND SALT WOULD CAUSE A TOXIC FUME. SINCE THEM I HAVE NOT BEEN ALLOWED BACK ON THE PROPERTY. ASK ME MORE AND I HOPE THAT I DID NOT BORE YOU, BUT I NEED TO DO SOMETHING CAUSE THIS COULD HAPPEN TO SOMEONE ELSE. THANKS FOR LISTENING. I SURE THAT THIS IS NOT RIGHT. THANKS

PEDRO CRUZ
- ELLISIAN VALLEY, California



simultaneous

Hi Pedro,
Interesting letter, but it still lacks specific information, which you say that the guy using it would not give to you.
That means, to me, that he did not want anyone else to know his secret formula that appears to have worked well for him. The other possibility is that he knows that it should not be used.

Vinegar smells like vinegar and nothing else. On some steels, it can pick up a rotten egg smell of hydrogen sulfide and that is dangerous. The good part of that is the smell is so bad that you rarely can get a serious dose.

Now, ammonia that you use from the store is not a nice smell, but again, it is difficult to get a serious dose of it. Industrial strength ammonia is another story. If you get one big breath of it, you can be in big trouble. It is enough to literally stop involuntary breathing. Note that a small vial of it is used for smelling salts, but that is only wafted near a persons face and is enough to shock a person back from being faint.

Bleach is another bad chemical. Industrial strength can react with a number of chemicals and in select cases produces an oxychlorine family of gas which is a war gas. One of which is phosgene.

Be glad that you are gone.

If you are really vindictive and they have 7 or more employees, tell your story to OSHA. They are in the phone book. Management will take most of the heat from this with little or nothing for the other employee other than being told that he can not use it. Expect lies, obfuscations and a coverup.

James Watts
- Navarre, Florida



Pedro,

If you have health and safety concerns you need to take it to your local health and safety authority. You are right that if it isn't dealt with there is the possibility of others suffering.

In the UK we have several routes, unfortunately I don't know the set up in the USA, but there will be a route to someone who knows what to look for.

If I was you I would start with my local government officials and seek advice from them about who to talk to.

Brian Terry
Aerospace - Yeovil, Somerset, UK

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