Metal finishing Q&As since 1989
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Recovering gold from electronics, page 5
I have hundreds lbs of PC boards, CPUs, memories, etc. from scrap computers, I like to find gold refining/recovery firms near my place, New York, New York,and I can send them for gold bars.
Edward Lee- Woodhaven, New York
2006
Under optimal conditions and following precise step by step instructions, approximately 1 oz. of gold can be recovered from approximately 15 lbs. of older ceramic CPUs and connector edges in Aqua Regia.
Charles Rogers- Jacksonville, Florida
2006
Hello, Please read this to the end before attempting this process. I use this set up: use 1 quart of HNO3 (nitric acid 70% technical grade) dilute to 50% , soak one kilogram of computer CPUs in the solution for a period of time till the CPUs legs are fell off the ceramic or fiber backing, please do not agitate the solution. What this is doing is removing the silver solder that bond legs to CPUs backing. Filter the gold legs with coffee filter or you can use old pair of panty hose which should not be affected by the acid – caution solution is acidic! Add table salt to the solution after you filter the gold out to recover silver chloride, it will be in the form of white flakes. You can refine gold in aqua regia by washing the gold legs in the hot water to remove silver salts, this is important because silver will lock the gold in aqua regia! What that mean is gold will not come out from aqua regia; it will be difficult to droop out gold from the aqua regia! Next mix the acids: 30% by volume (70% nitric acid) and 70% by volume (35% hydrochloric acid or muriatic acid [affil links] ). I use 300 ml of 70% nitric acid and 700 ml of 35% hydrochloric acid and it is working. Now you made the aqua regia – caution this solution is extremely acidic! Use 1 quart of aqua regia per 140 gram of gold legs. Don't use more then 140 gram of gold per 1 quart of aqua regia! I don't have time to explain why. Dissolve the gold, if it is not dissolving fast for you heat it a bit (90 F – 160 F) but not more than that, and please do it outside or under fume hood. I don't have time to explain why. After all your gold is in solution you need to mix one more think to neutralize the aqua regia; dissolve one and a half pound of urea in one quart of hot but not boiling water then add to the aqua regia till it will no longer fizz / bubble. Congratulation! You neutralize aqua regia. To precipitate gold from the neutralized aqua regia you going to need one to two teaspoon of sodium sulfite for each ounce of gold metal dissolved. Gold will come out of off the solution and settle on the bottom as brown particles that look like mud, this is 99,9% fine gold. This set up works on CPUs I don't know if it will work on everything.
Paul Prisyazhnyuk- Erie, Pennsylvania
2006
Since there is so little gold on the copper traces and wires, why not consider the gold a slight impurity and ignore it? Scrape/clip of the copper wires, melt the wires down and cast it as copper. Copper is not a cheap metal. It has to be WAY more valuable than the gold, and all it takes is heat to melt it.
Why does everyone want that recycled gold so badly? Cast the copper and sell the ingots instead.
- Ventura, California
2006
2006
I agree that using powerful acids is far too dangerous and costly for the small business, home business, hobbyist market. Especially when considering making a profitable enterprise.
I am an electronics engineer, and must also mention again, it is not solid gold in these electronics boards, the only gold in there, is the gold you can actually see on the surface of connectors, and it is VERY thin, it is simply to stop corrosion "on the surface" There is also nothing substantial hidden inside plain chips. If a large (CPU) chip is gold colored on top or bottom, it is still only a very thin layer, it isn't solid gold. It is so thin, you can't even scrape it off properly. Inside a CPU there is VERY fine connecting wires made from gold, (386 and 486 are best, old Pentiums have less fine gold wires) and you can crack them open, and scrape the wires with a sharp blade onto a glass plate, (don't blame me if you cut your finger please!:) and collect them to a nice pile... etc etc.. I have done this, but not for profit, as it is a time consuming and very wasteful process.
You are best to do as mentioned previously, and collect only all the gold looking stuff, stripping down best you can, and get a premium buy price from a good scrap dealer.
HOWEVER, the reason I am here, in this particular subject thread, is pretty much the same as everyone else's. I would like to refine my own small nugget of pure gold (and pgms would be nice too!) for my elements and mineral collection.
There seems to be a non acid and "safe" method of refining gold (and advertised commercially as a kit set) using simple salt solution(?) and ceramic filters, etc.
NOW wouldn't this be a great way to promote safe home chemistry, without the use of dangerous chemicals, if we could know what the process used.
NOW, as others have mentioned here, I would purchase this system, but where I live, it makes it a bit price prohibitive, and I am sure it is a simple solution which someone is marketing with a HUGE profit margin on the unit, (I don't know, maybe years of research did go into this kit set, but when the prices of them vary by hundreds of US$, it makes me wonder) and the ongoing supply of what must be simple and safe chemicals. (I cannot import ANY chemical into the country where I live, but may be able to buy them if I know what they are).
So, I ask this question of the experts, in the name of safety and simplicity, this safe electrolytic refinery process surely must be the answer to all our wonderings, but what the heck is it?
thanks,
elements collector - Auckland, New Zealand
Regarding that "HUGE profit margin", Tony, I think you'll find "The grass is always greener . . ."
But why don't you contact the manufacturer and get a license to distribute or manufacture the units and the chemistry on your side of the world and participate in the larceny? Despite any "safety and simplicity" justifications you advance, this website is not going to collaborate in the theft of trade secrets :-)
Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
December , 2006
What about gold melting pots, is that a way to melt the gold off circuit boards?
Jon Jacksonmobile computers - Suisun, California
2007
I would like to know how I can find large lots of scrap computer parts for precious metal recovery (refining) excluding eBay ? I have read questions on this site that people post who want to know how they can refine computer scrap because they have an endless supply (supplier). Can someone let me know the secrets to obtaining all that scrap for free or at little or no cost? I have done a lot of research gold refining and will share it with anyone. If you have solid karat gold scrap for refining such as 10 k, 14 k, 18 k, 24 k, solid gold jewelry (unplated), aqua regia method will not work. Aqua regia is for gold plated items only. You could use the Simplicity gold refining system for your solid gold items.
Thanks for your time and help!
- Ball Ground, Georgia
2007
2007
Actually solid gold can be done by aqua regia, I don't care what you read, I do it. I use aqua regia (now sub zero) Check ishor.com for solid gold, gold filled, circuit boards, memory, IC chips, processors and anything non metal based plated.
For pins and gold plated items I use a simple reverse electroplating cell. It simple to make, a Pyrex glass measuring cup. You need sulfuric acid,( I use "Rooto acid drain cleaner
[on
eBay or
Amazon]) (2 cups) glycerin (1/4 teaspoon) and you have your electrolyte, The cathode has to be lead, the anodes have to be stainless steel. use a 10 amp battery charger [on
eBay or
Amazon]
and your set, obviously there is more to it but that's the general set up the "poor mans way"
I have recovered over 3 pounds of 99% pure gold over a 2 year span using these two methods so I know what I'm talking about when I say you can do solid gold with subzero, and pretty much anything.
The reason there's so many questions and not enough answers is the general population is not mentally equipped to do this stuff, you can kill yourself easily or others. Not to mention the lazy ones you do not dispose of waste properly and just dump it anywhere. there are no shortcuts that do not result in harm! It is a tedious and detailed process and each step must be done correctly!
- Ashland, Pennsylvania
2007
Hey guys,
Just wanted to let anyone interested in gold refining from electronics scrap my experience. There really is not any money in it. First refiner I went to was a company in the North west Suburbs of Chicago. Sounds like "Progressive Soup" Refiners. I sent "Progressive Soups" precious metals division over 42 lbs of Mix heavy 1970s gold electroplated Pins from telecom equipment over 800 ceramic based CPUs, and about 2 troy oz. of 14 Kt yellow gold junk jewelry. They took 2 full months to get me a settlement check of a whopping $607.00 dollars . (I have documents to prove . half the stuff I got on eBay and the other half I bought from a retired Bell Labs employee. so I spent over $2000 dollars (not including my time and labor cleaning the crap. )
The other company I sent a similar amount but only 18 lbs (T oz) which I spent $1000 dollars minus my time and effort cleaning and pulling pins, and they sent me back a whopping $500.00 (five hundred u.s. dollars). This company which sounds like "Spackelty Helters and Sckelters Refiners". All this is the Truth, and nothing but (i have some significant paper documents to prove) . I am a hard working , God Fearing, Honest young man from the Midwest.
To be honest , I wish I never got involved with it. Also these "Gold Refiner's" have short fuses, or very lacking in customer service and relations. When I was calling around and told them I had over 40 lbs. of ceramics based CPUs, they were all very keenly interested, but why would they if the 40 plus lbs of Ceramics based Processors only yield about $600.00 U.S. dollars and their cut is only 10%? Something stinks and I am the sucker.
From my experience , I would recommend avoiding refiners, or just don't bother with e-trash (unless you are getting the stuff for free and don't have to clean any of it). I would have made more money if I auctioned my collection on eBay . Financially I have lost over $3000.00 dollars, and Lost over I think over 800 man hours of labor. Keep in mind this is for the "high yield electronics" . This is worse than slave labor, because at least a slave gets meals, and roof. Better to get gold from real scrap jewelry and sell to jeweler.
Are there any "Honest Refiners" ?
Thanks,
- Naperville, Illinois
American manufacturers have found it exceptionally difficult to compete against China, where skilled labor is available at 1/10 the cost. More than half of all e-waste goes to China where the desperate, who are unable to land those jobs that pay 10% of American wages, illegally refine this stuff on street corners and front porches to try to survive. You can smell the towns from miles away. Go to ted.com/tedtalks and search for the presentation by Ed Burtynsky, which is fabulous; one of the things it includes is the photos of these desperate people, their polluted towns and acrid air, their streets paved with e-waste.
If you want to compete in the free market against people who are scratching in the dirt to survive, and who would be elated if they could have hope that their children might someday make 10 percent of American minimum wage, then reclaiming e-waste may be for you.
I guess it's hard for those of us who don't have gold fever to understand what it's like :-)
Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
2007
2007
I am interested in recovering copper from electronic scrap, it seems to me that there is more copper in pcb's then gold or silver.
I would like to know in detail how it is done, is there anyone out there that will share?
Thanks
Dick
Richard R. Conway
- Clearlake, California
Look....I read all the responses from this site and questions...I come to this conclusion.... gold from computers has to be worth it. The free world is ALL collecting this stuff... and China is buying the computer boards whole by the container...and I have seen with my own eyes gold bars being loaded onto a bank truck in a SCRAP YARD...yes...gold in a scrap yard locked up...who would guess ... now it is obvious the newbies like me do not know the full extent of this...but something is up here...just like the guy talking about CAT CONVERTERS... actually they are over a $100 US and smelted worth a $1000...now this gold stuff is the same thing...before years back car scrap was everywhere, and all shops said please take it away..NOW,,everyone knows about it and stealing them off cars... the people that know about computer scrap are not making the same mistake...they are shutting up and getting rich...think about it...
But one thing for sure, soon it will come out because WAY too much interest now. But then will be hard to get a scrap computer ... everyone will be selling scrap...just like cars...cars that don't run and rotted, people still don't give them away ... These people who know and read this know what I am talking about.... and they are not going to say diddly squat to anyone...think about it would you if you have a sure thing...I DON'T THINK SO.....so you know what.... get a real job or hobby and forget it...unless you get one of these guys and choke them..LOL.... and maybe they will tell you...then ok...good luck everyone..because anything to do with money.... is called good luck.
Robert Talarico- Ontario, Canada
2007
2007
The world also trades in sand, gravel, and manure, Robert. That doesn't make them "precious". Do yourself the favor of reviewing some podcasts or videos of disabled Chinese people living in squalor and recycling this garbage. A short life-span, a constant eye-watering stench, living outside of the law, polluting their streets, and a few cents an hour, at most, are their reward for this recycling work. You are welcome to it.
As for "secretive", there are numerous peer-reviewed books, going back many decades, to tell you everything about precious metal recovery--there is nothing the least bit secret about it. There probably is a scam element to it when people suggest it is a road to riches and only they can guide you on that road.
Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
2007
This is for all questioners and respondents to this "topic".
I have been doing the "scrap process" as an amateur for many years. I have many contacts in the scrap business and a lesser number in precious metal recovery. I do it as a hobby; not necessarily, an income maker.
For the amateur:
Recyclers will only pay 50% of what they "know" they can sell for. That is, the least they can sell for. They will have every excuse as to why the item has little value.
Sodium or potassium cyanide is deadly for the amateur.
Agua regia is only a little less risky. Nitrates of lead, copper and mercury are explosive when dried.
Copper hydroxide,developed when using the heavy alkaline leaches, is deadly in small doses.
The list goes on for ever.
You can make a bit of money from it; but, you have to spend the money for equipment and the time to learn how to use each of the processes BEFORE you start. Learn the disposal process. Learn the SAFETY aspect of the process; know them by heart.
AND FOLKS, IT AIN'T EASY!
For the professional:
The acidic/SSN/chlorine (SSN=saturated salt natant), where the acid is HCl, is by a wide margin the safest for the backyard recycler.
webpages.charter.net/kwilliams00/bcftp/front.htm.
This guy has some formulas for those that will allow users to work a bit more safely, if they follow instructions. There are others, but this was handy.
- Socorro, Texas
2007
Gday all,
Very interesting topic! Personally I have done hours of research into the economic viability & environmental liability of numerous processes involved with the recycling of ALL e-waste. As the exponential rise of ewaste continues, the amount of e-waste exported to third world countries has increased. There is a convention in place for most countries regarding export of this toxic waste, the Basel conv., however the leading country involved in the formation of said conv., America, has not adopted any of the practices regarding the export of these toxic substances, and still export to poor countries for them to deal with to the best of their economic ability, with disastrous consequences!
The only way to prevent more damage to our perhaps already dying planet, is to adopt safe process from the very beginning, the manufacturers. Surely with their billions of bucks they CAN create more recycle friendly equipment using less toxic materials and identifying the toxic substances they do use.
As has been said many times before THIS STUFF WILL KILL YOU maybe not now but it builds up in organic systems. Look at the report the US Navy has done on Beryllium commonly used as a heat sink paste, you don't want to touch the stuff!
[deleted by editor] you blokes [deleted by editor] around with this stuff have not researched the full dangers of what you are trying to deal with, and if you have, you don't give a [deleted by editor]. Several towns in poorer countries now do. Travel for miles to find uncontaminated drinking water, kids maimed and mutilated by acids, the list goes on.
Sell or give ALL your unwanted electronic equipment to an accredited e-waste recycler for the good of OUR EARTH OUR CHILDREN & THEIR CHILDREN, the are many good ones out there, find them.
Let me assure you to recycle e-waste to recover the precious metals & common metals requires a huge amount of capital, licensing, & knowledge also you must have ethics, not just out for the quick buck. Bloody hell burning boards, acid leaching, etc., that process alone you people are stuffing OUR earth. You must take the temperature up to at least 1300 °C to destroy the dioxins, the emissions taken through a two stage wet filter then a two stage dry filter and must continually monitored. Can you afford or have the knowledge and approval for this? This is just the first process! Let alone removing all metals from acid solutions, to make them safe for disposal!
Come on get some sense about yourselves, support accredited e-waste recyclers, the only profit from e-waste comes from economy of scale and should not be treated as a hobby, please look after our mother earth, she's the only one we have!
- Brisbane, QLD, Australia
HI EVERYONE,,I JUST FOUND THIS WEB-SITE-SO COOL---MY QUESTIONS ARE--FIRST OF ALL I KNOW NOT A THING ABOUT GOLD..I HAVE CAME ACROSS A LOT OF COMPUTERS BROADS..QUESTIONS ARE,,I THINK THE GOLD PINS ARE PLATED? BUT I HAVE A LOT OF SILVER ONES ARE THESE WHITE GOLD? I ALSO NOTICE A LOT OF BLACK THINGS ON THIS BROADS[[BOXES]]SHOULD I TAKE THESE OFF THE BROADS I HAVE NO CLUE WHAT THESE ARE CALLED IS THEIR GOLD IN THESE?DO THE BOARDS THEM SELF HAVE GOLD IN THEM? SHOULD I TAKE THE TIME TO BRAKE THE BOARDS UP? I WOULD LIKE TO THANK ANYONE WHO COULD HELP ME WITH MY QUESTIONS--THANKS
MICHEAL AHLSTUDENT - CORNING, California
2007
Get rich quick or die trying .... I think its the latter in this case, the environmental costs of these idiots setting fire to circuit boards all over the planet beggars belief!
Colin Colboy- Poole, UK
2007
Can I use DC current to extract the Gold from a NX stripper(base)that has Potassium Cyanide in it to strip the gold that has become heavily laden in gold stripped from plated terminals and circuit board connectors. If so, do I need to pacify the cyanide before removing the gold. I hope to plate the gold to a piece of stainless steel bar and melt the gold from it in a crucible to pour into a mold.
Steve Caldwellhobbyist - Winston Salem, North Carolina
2007
I've come across lots of information detailing the methods of recovery of various precious metals, including gold/silver/PGMs from electronic scrap. Personally, never tried it, never will. It is not worth the time, expense, effort or inherent dangers to attempt this on a small scale. Some people trying to sell you certain books will try to convince you that it can be done by anyone in your basement or garage. But, they're trying to sell you a book. I have a question, though... Where are you guys getting all this computer/telecom/electronic scrap? I've read several posts from folks saying they have tons. I'd love to know how I could get my hands on some. Any pointers would be greatly appreciated.
Tom Banks- Woodstock, Minnesota
2007
It depends what town you live in, Tom. In some towns the citizens are encouraged to take any stuff from the town dump that they feel they can reuse -- and that includes old radios, telephones, computers, TVs, and stereos.
Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
2007
2007
To the general public knowledge: PMG recovery is cut-throat business.
Cut fingers from the PC board, pull all gold plated contact from the MoBo (Motherboard) Get them in large plastic or glass container 3 Liter or larger, use one pint of 70% Nitric acid with 1 pint of distill water, add 40 gram of metal contacts bearing gold to the acid
. Let it sit for a month at room temperature. Agitate container once a day. Acid will get hot - work it self true the base metal (does not work on stainless steel) after all base metal dissolve in acid you going to see the gold color flakes on the bottom of the container, to be sure that liquid is neutral and all acid is gone add a piece of copper wire to the solution to kill the rest of acid, pore distilled water to the solution let the gold particles to settle down on the bottom of the container pore the solution with out the gold flakes into plastic container or glass you can recover copper and other metals later just add aluminum to the solution. Add hot distilled water to the gold flakes. Let it stand for the hour or so, gold will settle on the bottom of the container, pore the water off of this container in the drain it contains wary little metal salts.
The most efficient method to get gold from the gold flakes metal is to use Mercury / Sodium amalgam. It is not too difficult to recharge the mercury after it is exhausted in the processes of gold recovery. It is safe if one takes full precautions in mercury recovery after it's been in used. Mercury / Sodium amalgam can absorb one third of its weight in gold. So if you need to absorb one troy ounce of gold it will take 100 gram of Mercury / Sodium amalgam.
- Erie, Pennsylvania
I'll probably be accused of somehow being in cahoots with the major refineries because people can be pissy when they have gold fever; nonetheless . . .
One problem with e-waste is that amateur recycling is a wrecking ball that scatters the toxic materials everywhere. Add to it that the cost of recycling the whole item is so close to break even that when 'cherry picking' like this is done, you inflict the planet and the rest of us with the balance of the toxic waste in unrecoverable form and scattered everywhere. This video, and there are dozens like it from every major environmental organization, explains why leaving the computer whole is a central ingredient in gaining control over the world's e-waste problem:
Crutchfield has a nice little widget on their website at http://www.crutchfield.com/environmental-policy/recycling.html that lets you plug in your zip code and get a list of recyclers.
Ted Mooney, P.E.
Striving to live Aloha
finishing.com - Pine Beach, New Jersey
Hey people what melts metal, da?
It's heat. grind the boards up to small stuff, put it in a pot and heat it up.
then the heavier metal goes to the bottom.
The scrap yard does it. If you add a little gold to the pot when you heat it the other gold will go to it when you melt the stuff
wala ... gold , silver, lead.
- rouseville, Pennsylvania
2007
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