Letter 28015

Will distilled water conduct electricity  

++++ I AM CURRENTLY DOING A 5TH GRADE SCIENCE PROJECT AND I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IF DISTILLED WATER WILL CONDUCT ELECTRICITY AND IF IT DOES NOT CAN YOU TELL ME WHY KASSIE B STUDENT - WEST BABYLON, NEW YORK ++++ This may be too advanced for 5th grade, Kassie. Everything is relative, so yes, it will conduct electricity--but very very little compared to city water, well water, or salt water. The reason is that the way a liquid conducts electricity is by the positively or negatively charged ions that are in it actually moving from one of the electrodes to the other, carrying charge (electricity) with them. Salt water has salt in it, NaCl, which readily ionizes or dissociates to ions of Na+ and Cl- which can float through the water carrying charge and thus conducting electricity. Distilled water is water that was boiled to steam and recondensed to water. Virtually all the salt that was originally in it is left behind as the pure water boils away. So distilled water is relatively pure H2O (HOH). Water can ionize to H+ and OH- like salt does, but it ionizes to a far, far, far, lesser degree and is therefore very resistant to conducting electricity. Ted Mooney, P.E.  finishing.com Brick, New Jersey ++++ To what extent does distilled water ionize, and what causes it to do so? I was wondering about the possibility of running an electrical system like a PC under pure distilled water. Is this feasible? Thanks, Edward Sinclair - Swaffham, Norfolk, England (near Scotland)

Hi, Edward. Yes you can run electrical devices submerged in very pure water. But distilled water may not be pure enough. And as soon as you put the PC in the water, some salts from soldering fluxes or other sources may start contaminating it. You probably would need to recirculate the water through a very capable deionization system such as is used to generate ultra pure water for semiconductor fabrication to remove that salt.

Regards,

Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

Water doesn't conduct electricity at all...sorry but it is true.

Joyce Eblen
- Manhattan, Kansas

Joyce don't be quick to jump to conclusions based on myths you've been told all your life. The truth is water DOES conduct electricity, even PURE DISTILLED water. The fact is electrically speaking there is 3 categories of materials: Conductors, insulators, and semi-conductors. Even insulators will conduct electricity if sufficient voltage is applied to them to overcome their huge resistance.

While developing a precipitation sensor I personally conducted multiple experiments on conduction thru water and especially distilled water as rain water is mostly mineral free. I tried various brands of distilled water and even some I distilled myself thru a vat system. The results were all the same. At 12 v and using the same distance apart on the electrodes I observed a current of about 70 micro amps passing thru the water. And yes, you're right that's a horrible conductor but it was NOT zero it did conduct and using higher voltages would even further overcome the resistance and the results would most likely NOT be linear as you increase the voltage the resistance would break down and you would see a curved results line.

Jared Greathouse
- Chillicothe, Ohio

Indeed water can be rated by its conductivity. For example, in the semiconductor industry they often use "ultrapure" water with a conductivity of 18 micro-ohm-cm.

Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

I am a 6th grade student doing a science experiment on whether a battery can conduct through water to make a buzzer ring. So far I have used 2, 1.5 V AA batteries with nothing, then I added another 1.5 V with nothing happening. Finally, I hooked up a 9 V and nothing happened. When I touched the wires together under water the buzzer rang but even if the wires were a mm apart the buzzer did not work. Do I need a stronger battery or do I really need A LOT of electricity? Or will this even work?

Barbara G
- Fort Worth, Texas

I suspect that it won't work, Barbara. Liquids do not conduct electricity anywhere near as well as metal. Do not use a higher voltage battery, as it could start getting dangerous. But start by putting the two wires very close together in a bowl of wet salt. If that doesn't work, it doesn't work. If it does, use more water and less salt until it doesn't work.. Good luck.

Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

Interesting.. I was just pondering this subject.. nice to know that others are inquiring.. I have always said that water is a poor conductor.. never knew any specifics though. I have ran many 12 v DC applications completely submerged in H20 with no issue.

Ben Lewis
- Newberry, Michigan

I AM IN 6th GRADE AND I AM DOING A PROJECT ON "IS WATER A CONDUCTOR OF ELECTRICITY" AND I HAVE FIGURED OUT THAT WATER IS NOT A CONDUCTOR UNLESS YOU USE WELL OR CITY BECAUSE THEY HAVE MINERALS AND DISTILLED WATER YOU HAVE TO ADD IMPURITIES SUCH AS SALT AND I WAS WONDERING IF I WAS RIGHT.

JIMMY P
SCHOOL - MARBEL HILL, GEORGIA

I am the father of a second grader who is learning how water conducts.

Our experiment was performed with one AA battery, three cups half filled with water and different amounts of salt.
and an electric motor.

At first we used a wire for the contact but found that the wire only bubbled when the battery was applied.

That didn't mean we needed more electricity or salt, it meant that we needed more surface area.
So we attached some aluminum foil to the end of each wire that was in the cups and then it worked.

In most cases, electricity travels around the outside of a solid object first.

In a liquid, because a liquid is always in motion, energy will move through the inside with ease.

In our experiment, we increased the surface area of the solid so the maximum amount of metal was touching the liquid, so the maximum amount of electricity could be transferred.
Hope this helps.

Jeromy
- Bellevue, Washington

I just did an experiment w/ my daughter using a series of L.E.D.'s (+ to -) I soldered together along w/ a 1k ohm resistor between the 9-volt battery and the L.E.D.'s on both positive and negative end. This experiment worked great. I used jumper wires w/ alligator clips to connect one end (+ or - doesn't seem to matter) from the battery directly (via the resistor) to the corresponding (+ to + or - to -) pole on the L.E.D.'s. On the opposite pole I used two sets of jumper wires one running from the battery to a plastic bowl of distilled water then a second jumper wire from the opposite end of the bowl (not touching the first) to the L.E.D.'s (again + to + or - to -) via the resistor. I hope this doesn't have some inherent flaw in it.

Jason Detty
- Bremerton, Washington

Diodes only allow electricity to flow in one direction, Jason, so the polarity should matter. I'm surprised that it could work if the diodes were reversed, but I may have misunderstood your description. I note this so that if you start getting anomalous results, of when current flows and when it doesn't, the direction of the diodes can account for the current not flowing.

Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

So... if it's impossible to have truly pure, particle-free water, then we have to ask the ultimate question of: "Does water, in it's most basic, purest form, conduct?" I always thought that the answer, in theory, was no. After a lot of cross-referencing and much deliberation, I've come to the tentative conclusion that, electrons, in their affinity for diffusion in favor of a conductor, will travel through any object, water included, up to a point, depending on the strength of the charge. Electrons, being what electrical currents are comprised of, are too powerfully simple, and unstoppable in their never-ending quest for molecular diffusion.
That being said, I think that since all things are made up of atoms, and that they themselves already have electrons present, that all those things already have a natural affinity for accepting the purchase of outside electrons traveling in a diffusive nature.

PFC Steve J Bell, Cmbt Medic
- Camp Taji, Iraq-OEF

First things first, Private Bell: THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE TO OUR COUNTRY!

Very pure water used in semi-conductor fabrication is 18 megaohm-cm. You can compare this to other materials and see that the resistance is quite high. Pure water conducts very little, but it conducts. Pure water conducts very very slightly because H2O very very very slightly ionizes to H+ and O--^^OH-

Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

Water will not ionize to give you doubly charged O (ie. O--) but rather hydronium (H3O+) and hydroxide (OH-). The protons don't just break off, they have to be taken off.

Just adding my chemist hat's two cents.

:)

Eric Freeburg
- Jonesboro, Arkansas

Absolutely, Eric. I can't account for my writing something which was so obviously and knowingly wrong. Must have been on my 3rd nightcap :-)

Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

50 years ago I did a science project, trying to determine whether heat affected the conductivity of electrolytic solutions. It did. I used 3 different solutions, can't remember what they were. Trying to help young friend now in High School do same experiment. I used household AC current, blew a few fuses. He is planning to use 6-volt battery, reading conductivity via a small multi-meter. It may work (hasn't tried yet) but I don't think it would be as impressive, although safer. Do you agree, and how would be a safe way to pass AC current through containers of liquid? And should the meter be in-line, or with probes immersed in the liquid, between nails or copper rods or whatever he uses? Any suggestions on how to make it more impressive or better? I merely used hotplates to heat the solutions.

Jan Myers
- San Antonio, Texas

Yes, very pure water does conduct a little.
I would definitely suggest that connecting household current directly into a container of water is unscientific and dangerous. If you really want to know, find yourself a decent multimeter, set it to megohms, and stick the probes in the water. Failing that, get a very cheap calculator and stick it in distilled water. If it stops working properly, you'll have your answer.

Phil Jackson
- Portsmouth, Hampshire, England

Are there any superior materials you can mention that are fairly accessible that when dissolved in water will heat rapidly with electricity applied that aren't toxic? This is a science project to reinvent the jail-house immersion heater.

Thanks,

Jason N
- Keansburg, New Jersey

Hey Science nerds,

Today in my amazing science class, we did an experiment on the conductivity of water. We tested many different types of water. In our results we found out that pure distilled water did not conduct electricity but water which had chemicals added to it like sea water did.

From this set of results we realized that water only conducts when it forms an ion.

Please can someone reply, I would love to be part of the science gang.

Tom Year 10 (mental age of a 8 year old)

Tom K
- New York

My friend and I are doing a science project in school and we are in grade 8 and we were wondering why does electricity flow in water? our aim is to create electricity through running water. We also want to demonstrate that with more salt added to the water, the brighter the light bulb will get.

so my question is whether electricity does flow in water and how?

Karima W.
student - Bali, Indonesia

October 16, 2008

I'd like to take a scientific stab at answering this question for the readers.
Electricity flows because of the transmission of energy through ions, which can be refereed to as charged particles.
Like it has been said on this forum before, water can ionize in an aqueous (liquid) form to the less common H30+ and OH- ions. This causes water to be a very weak electrolyte no matter how many times it is boiled or deionized.
Other liquids like sugar or car antifreeze, don't break down into ions in liquid form, therefore they don't conduct electricity unless they have impurities. Even molecules that ionize in water won't conduct electricity if they are in a solid form (salt in the shaker).
It has been proposed that water makes energy and that an increase in ion concentration (adding more salt) will increase the current flow or voltage. If the bulb were connected to the battery on one pole and a wire attached to the other pole leading to a container of water, another wire could be strung from the other pole of the battery and this would make the glass of water a switch or resistor. The wires could be removed/replaced in the water to connect the circuit; the resistance of the water could be lowered by increasing the amount of ions in the water (which could be increased by adding salt or other substances that ionize in an aqueous solution). Ohm's law says Voltage = Current / Resistance, so the less resistance the higher the voltage and the brighter the bulb.
Water is generally harnessed through it's kinetic energy or through energy gained from it's disassociation/re association (ie hydrogen fuel cell).

Erik Rogers, BSME
- Riverside, California

My daughter is working on a similar science project, however, she is using soda, orange juice, and distilled water. Will electricity flow through soda and orange juice?

Laura Martinez
- Chicago, Illinois

Hi, Laura. Experienced researchers usually do the research first and the experiments second to save some effort. But those researchers have expertise and self confidence, and can usually be trusted to honestly record their findings when they differ from what their research led them to believe would happen,

But I think students should do the experiment first and the research later because a young student will almost never have the experience and self confidence to trust their own findings when they don't agree with the research. And consequently they will carefully practice and carefully learn "junk science" (learning to lie to them self and adjust what they "saw" to match the answer they're 'supposed' to get).

So tell us what results she got when she tried to get electricity to flow through soda and orange juice, and then we'll try to help her understand those results. Good luck.

Regards,

Ted Mooney, P.E.  finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

why does water conduct electricity and other objects do not?

Chris H
student - Elkridge, Maryland

Hi, Chris. Please express your question in terms of what has already been said on this page, rather than starting over. But water does not conduct electricity and many other objects do, so now you have two reasons to rephrase it :-)    Good luck.

Regards,

Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

I am a 6th grader doing a science project on making a light bulb light up with distilled water and other substances. I have about tried everything but my light bulb won't turn on. What are some good substances I should try?

Casie P
Student - El Paso, Texas

Hi, Casie. No liquid will conduct electricity anywhere near as well as copper wire, so it is possible that your bulb is too big or your batteries too small. But try very salty water and, instead of just putting two wires in it, attach sheets of aluminum foil to them as Jeromy described on Jan 21, 2007. Good luck.

Regards,

Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

If pure water does not conduct electricity, whey do i still need to be careful about electricity near water?

grade 12 student

Sara B
student - Calgary, Canada

Hi, Sara. Because you are unlikely to find "pure" water and, even if you did, whatever went into the water, whether it be you and or some electrical device, will immediately render the water impure. Saying that pure water doesn't conduct electricity is something for science class not for real life.

Regards,

Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey

March 2, 2009 Our third grader is preparing a science fair project and he wants to focus on batteries and what conducts electricity best. He was going to focus on various random liquids from vinegar to salted water. But we wonder if it might be more interesting for him to do the project focusing on different types of salt water - homemade salt water, ocean salt water, tropical fish saltwater, Clorox that has converted to salt (does it really?)...and so on. Do you have any thoughts on this approach? Thanks so much from all of here. Susie Kher student's parent - Sammamish, Washington March 4, 2009 Hi, Susie. Table salt is sodium chloride. Sea salt is largely sodium chloride (NaCl) but will contain traces of other salts, as will aquarium salt. Bleach (NaOCl) is not salt, although you may be right that it can be converted to salt. I think you are on the right track of trying to search for some relationship rather than just measuring the conductivity of a dozen different things with no organizing principle, but I'd go further. I think the best approach would be to measure the conductivity with varying amounts of sodium chloride added to the water, and graphing the relationship. You can start with distilled water and go all the way from a very tiny pinch of salt in distilled water to a thick paste of salt and water. Hopefully the conductivity vs. the concentration will produce a nice graph that offers some insights. (For example, you may find that the conductivity tops out early on and additional salt has no effect). Regards, Ted Mooney finishing.com Brick, New Jersey   opt